I don't know if it was the beautiful weather or if Halloween falling on a Sunday had something to do with it, but I found myself inundated most of the afternoon. It's not 3-4 kids at a time. It's mass mobilization and deployment upon a street. Over 25 years, I would give out about 75 treats. Today was easily +300 and reserves were all gone by 6PM.
Was your experience similar? What are your thoughts? A neighbor e-mailed me this evening suggesting to cut back on the number of hours. Some of you may not think of this as a big deal, and some of you may try to politicize this with other issues out there right now. That's fine. But I look at this issue from the perspective that Halloween is just like the Birthday Celebration and the Christmas Parade. It's another opportunity to celebrate our community and its not just for the benefit of the children growing up in Merchantville. When we become the "surrogate" trick-or-treat neighborhood for Camden, is there an adverse effect on households here both old and young in regards to Halloween?
58 comments:
I've lived here about 25 years. I've never experienced a Halloween like this! It wasn't so much the number (although I had 300+ also) but it was the way the people came and grabbed. My daughter and I sat on the porch and gave out treats. Lots of cute costumes and polite kids...but an equal amount of swarms of huge groups with adults (some in costume and some not) who grabbed more than one treat (including the adults). As my daughter said at the end of the evening (and Halloween is her favorite holiday) it felt like we were attacked. I have always been glad to give out treats...even lots of them. But this was not a civilized or fun event. I actually went out in the dark and took down my decorations.
Our experience was similar to what you described. By 4:30 I was hustling over to McFarlan's for more candy. I really don't care about the circumstances which may have brought children from outside the community to Merchantville. This was an innocent, simple event for children on a picturesque day. I hope the children have well remembered recollections of it and the people whose simple act of opening their door (many times) and giving a child a piece of candy caused the day to be more beautiful.
Exactly the same experience as Susan. In past years, I felt bad for families who didn't have a safe neighborhood in which to trick-or-treat. This year, there were A LOT of families pulling up in cars. Many, many of them were polite and dressed in cute costumes (adults too). But we definitely had more "grabbers" than usual, even when I asked them to please take only one piece of candy. We had planned to give out candy until but I got frustrated at the ugly behavior and closed our door at 4:30 to take our kids out trick-or-treating.
Would that it were so Cruiser! For the most part the large crowds of grabby tricksters were wearing expensive store bought costumes. Price those lately? And many of the large crowds had people hanging back carrying their extra bags. When we remarked to some of the children that their bags were empty they replied that they had already filled one bag and were working on bag two (or three!!!).
Not a lot of innocence or beauty from my point of view.
Gave out treats for four hours!!!
Cruiser, you may need to look up the word "innocent" in the dictionary. Or you just didn't actually participate yesterday, because my wife and I had the same experience as Susan, Eleanor, and Anonymous. At first we were excited by the number of children, but then we started noticing the fleets of minivans and cars trucking up our block. Our porch has two entrances, and on many occasions, we were swarmed from both sides. My wife started out opening the door to hand out candy to each person, but this soon proved too much for her, as she's 6 months pregnant with our first child. I sat with her on our porch rocker and attempted to hand out treats when the hordes would descend, only to practically lose a hand as many grabby adults, no costumes, filled their own bags with 4, 5, 6 treats from the bin as my wife said gently "just one please...just one please." Her politeness was often rewarded with a "What are you gonna do about it?" smirk from whoever was grabbing things. It was like an evil version of Supermarket Sweep!
To say that at any point we were given the opportunity to "[give] a child a piece of candy" and make the day "more beautiful" is simply not relating what happened. Your heartwarming last sentence should have read more like "I hope the children have well remembered recollections of being farmed by their parents for as much as they could selfishly grab away from other kids, the parents and childless adults in pricey costumes have beautiful, tear-jerking memories of how much they themselves snatched from children who actually live in or near this town (including Camden) and like this holiday, and they all remember the suckers whose simple act of opening their door (while they pounded on it and yanked at the knob until it shook on its hinges) and giving a selfish adult or their trained equally selfish kids everything they could grab caused the day to be more profitable.
Tom, the behavior at our house did not happen the way you experienced it. Was there the rowdy eagerness of children - definitely yes. Overall, it was a nice day.
Cruiser, where do you live??? You didn't get a SINGLE adult?????? I want to move there!!!!!!!
"If you're not outraged you're not paying attention."
We had hoards on West Walnut. There was no grabbing - because we sat on the step and put candy in each bag.
Kids who weren't dressed at all got nothing, and sheepishly went away empty-handed when they couldn't explain what they were dressed as besides "I came as myself!".
Those with minimal effort, like a backwards hoodie, got a dum-dum lollipop - which seemed to embarrass them, especially if some of their friends were more costumed and we rewarded them with something better.
There were moms with infants in strollers. Actual, toothless babies and no other kids in tow. They got a smile, our best wishes, and no candy!!!!
I think the expression is:
"If you're not outraged you're not paying attention." ....
"to Fox News and talk radio".
i was scared to not give ppl candy, they were all grabby and nasty about it
I'm not a big fan of store bought outfits, but atleast they put something into it.
I feel bad for the parents of the teen girls that were barring too much skin - dressed as wenches, or pole-dancers, or whatever it is that they were dressed as.
My favorite was the girl dressed as a toasted marshmallow on fire! Ya just can't buy that costume at Wally-Mart!!!
I had very few without any costume at all (shout out to the young man with the scary mask/fright wig and the t shirt that simply said BOO!...marshmellow girl was good and the female rock star "from the 80s"). But still all of that doesn't mask the real feeling of snatch and grab that was going on. (no pun intended) I agree with Nina...I'd be afraid not to give candy. I sat outside and talked, etc....but everyone got candy. There was no way I would have gotten away with not giving any and all. I had the same experience as Susan, Anonymous, Eleanor,Tom, and Heather T. It left me with a very unsettled and uncomfortable feeling. Never felt that way in Merchantville (especially on Halloween) before.
I guess we should be flatterred to be a Halloween destination. We saw lots of kids coming in from surrounding Pennsauken, Cherry Hill and Camden. Everyone in my experience was very well behaved, except for one group that insisted on more than one piece LOL. I would recommend placing the candy in the kids bag, rather than letting them grab.
Merchantville Mom, that's not a bad idea, it did help in certain situations for me, but in most others I was putting something in their bag and the person WENT INTO MY BUCKET AND GRABBED SOMETHING ELSE TO GO WITH IT. You might say I should move my bin inside. I say, people should get better manners and some humility. I'm over 70 years old and I've sat on my porch every Halloween and given out the treats. After this year, never again.
Hey look at it this way: we fed the better part of South Jersey yesterday, whether they were needy or just greedy! :-P
I liked the little girl dressed like a donut. Too cute!
THE CROWDS WERE UNBELIEVABLE AT MY HOUSE. I FELT LIKE A RELIEF WORKER IN PORT-AU-PRINCE. IT WAS A SPOOKIE HALLOWEEN TO SAY THE LEAST.
Best Halloween ever! I'm sure next year will be even bigger because kids like to go where lots of other kids go and we are a Halloween destination. I think it's great, but I witnessed none of the grabbing (children are usually afraid of me though).
How many of you had the Camden-ites that had a bag for "grandma" who was at home? I saw some things this year that I have never seen before. I gave out over 300 pieces on Westminster.
It was disturbing. It didn't make me feel good in any way. I think most of them were looking back trying to figure out ways to steal my bike from my garage.
if you are taller than me, then you are too old for trick or treat
if you can pull off a slutty costume, then you are too old to trick or treat
OK so normally I don't post on here but I have to point out that we had an excessive amount of trick or treaters in my neighborhood, and frankly I think it had to do with the fact that we gave people 8 HOURS to trick or treat here. I can't say for sure because I felt like I was hallucinating by the end there, but I'm pretty sure I got at least several duplicates. Maybe they just didn't remember me, the dude in flannel PJ pants who kept throwing mini Snickers onto the lawn to appease the hordes...
BTW, Mr Eman, what type of riot gear did you wear to survive your American-Idol-like costume judging and candy-awarding ceremony with each trick or treater? Hate to say, but this isn't 1960 anymore, doing that will get you a punch in the nose (or at least a public screaming match)!
we sat on the step and put candy in each bag.
When I lived on Springdale Road and Route 70 (now Camden County College) as a kid, houses were a quarter mile apart or farther. So we selected houses with the greatest receptivity for treating in our area. Afterwards we asked a relative to take us to Haddonfield for our I'm-too-sick-to-go-to-school-tomorrow treats. Of course the ride was conditioned on our promise not to sicken ourselves.
Treating in a big, wealthy town impressed us kids with lasting memories only outshone by our subsequent rides through town to see their Christmas decorations.
Feel comfortable, Merchantville Halloween hosts, that the young trick or treaters will think highly of you, especially if you hold to Mr. Eman's delivery control methods. Respect is learned best when firmly modeled.
KTBFW, now imagine that, as a kid, those houses in Haddonfield were shut up with their lights out when you got there because all the candy had been double-fisted by carloads of greedy, careless grownups in $100 polyester costumes. As a kid, I would have been crying.
Also, it's hard to teach respect to people old enough to rent cars who are trick or treating along with their children. Same goes for the children they actually coach to grab as much as possible from the hosts.
I just saw the ugly, selfish side of a lot of people yesterday, kids and adults alike, and it made me sad. I'm willing to give out as much candy as I can to as many kids as possible if they have a costume and are nice and polite. I just felt taken advantage of.
There was a time when you played a guess who? game with the trick or treaters, because they were your neighbors. They played with your children, went to the same school, etc. Now, when you have groups of children and adults numbering up to 30 at a time. (no exaggeration!) you look for the bus that surely must have brought them to your street. It sure takes the fun away.
I helped my mother with the trick or treaters for hours yesterday and was ultimately left speechless by the shameless greedy nature of the adults, brazenly coming onto our porch and performing a candy smash-and-grab.
My friend who lives out of state told me yesterday morning that he planned to not answer the door and stay inside with headphones on. I told him he should be nice and open his door to the sweet, innocent trick-or-treaters but after yesterday, his actions just seem like common sense for next year.
To the anonymous poster who asked about the "grandma" bags, I got many of those! Literally every other group had at least one or two grownups with one of those bags. And that was when they felt like making up an excuse for taking candy away from children. Most of the time, they just took stuff..
I'm with Freddie J. 8 hours is TOO LONG. The kids get tired, the weird costumed adults descend, and the citizens of Merchantville are left with only a small supply of Tootsie Rolls between them and getting a window broken.
I too was made very uneasy and uncomfortable yesterday by all this.
I saw a lot of well-behaved kids and parents having fun. I didn't see any grabbers or other things I found offensive. I was happy to have them and can't help but wonder if the people who complained about the behavior of the trick-or-treaters would have perceived the grabbers as grabbers or just people having fun if they were white. I think the ugliness that is on show comes primarily from the people already living here.
To Anon 11:04 p.m.
Ahh, the well-thumbed and ever-ready race card. Always a reliable substitute for thought and respect for others' opinions. Well played.
To Anon 5:04 a.m.
If you don't think that race has something to do with how a predominantly (formerly?) white community perceives what happens when Black and Hispanic people come into town, you must be new to this world. The same behavior by a group of white children is explained as "children will be children" while that behavior when taken by Black children is viewed as anti-social and reflective of a racial group. Welcome to Race in America whether you like it or not.
There's not much debated in the public arena in this town (consolidation? bike path? high school?) in which race is not just below the surface. White folks here would do well to name what's going on rather than avoiding addressing the issue, speaking in code, and not challenging one's biases and assumptions.
It's not that there's not some truth in what people said. The trick-or-treaters were different in many ways. But those perceptions and the way people write about them cannot be detached from race and reflect irrationality, fear, and prejudice. White people "scared" to not give people candy? Give me a break.
The rudeness crossed all races and cultures. This was nothing to do with race. All to do with behavior.
The point is Halloween of this type... is something never seen before in Merchantville. At least not in my 25 years as a resident. And it is not something I'd like to see repeated. Although I don't know how anything can be done to change it. Perhaps those of us who felt used and abused should just shut our doors next year and give all the "joy" to those who loved it. But I suggest you buy a lot more candy!
Tricked again...even though I gave out hundreds of treats. Came back from voting this morning and noticed some candy wrappers on the lawn and sidewalk. Normal. Then I noticed quite a few tucked into my decorative flower pots on my porch...wrappers from stuff I didn't give out. The joy of the day just goes on and on.
I agree. Not what we've come to expect here in Merchantville.
We were taught that our behavior was a reflection of how we were being raised and to take care not to bring embarrassment to the family.
If individuals behave crudely in public among strangers, it seems to me natural for observers to cast blame upon their apparent religion, race, age, gender.
It's not that they don't know the golden rule. It's that they do not care ... or think they might cry foul with their own race/religion cards if called to account for the rudeness.
If terrorists cared that their society were being maligned by their actions, they would not have become terrorists. The fact is they benefit from the criticism.
There is no doubt in my mind that uncivil trick-or-treaters believe they gain by their behavior. Or they wouldn't do it.
So why should we refrain from attacking them and their roots?
To Anon 6:08
Those race-colored glasses just go with every issue, don't they? Thanks for being there to show the rest of us how ignorant and benighted we all are. You're the best!
If the streets of a prominently black town was suddenly filled with white people the residents would ask "Where did all there white people come from, and why?"
But if a prominently white town is suddenly filled with people of color its racist for us to ask the same question.
I believe there are more bigots of color than not. They just claim their bigotry is justified.
Halloween 2010 in Merchantville was NOT a racially motivated event. None of the comments here talked of race. They talked of marauding hordes. They talked of how different this year was from all the other years...ALL THE OTHER YEARS.
When I was a young mother I walked with my children and with other young mother's and father's and their children to the houses of my neighbors. We only went as far as the kids could walk in their costumes. We took only what was offered as a treat. And we always said thank you. Chronologically that kind of Halloween was still going on even last year. This year was a completely different kind of Halloween. Hardly any homemade costumes. Adults in costumes not accompanying children but with bags of their own. We even had two women in their forties trick or treating with no children at all.
If Merchantville wants to be a Halloween destination then let's take spaces downtown or around the community center or around the school and give out treats to any and all. Let's have a parade. Perhaps it was just the publicized length of time for the event and perhaps next year will be better because Halloween won't fall on a weekend. But perhaps this is a different kind of change that speaks to bigger societal (NOT racial) issues. I've got mine and I want yours too. Gimme.
There's no problem with discussing where people come from. It's ridiculous to suggest otherwise (although increasingly you will find "they" came from next door). And there's no excuse for littering or truly anti-social behavior. But much complaining is based on the perception that the people of color who came here were behaving differently when they were simply walking down the street. White kids are often loud too, but it's because they are kids not because they are white. When black kids are loud, according to many people, it's because they are black.
The person who was afraid to give out candy and the person who was scared that her bike was going to be stolen are paranoid and playing the classic role of the scared white person who wakes up one morning to realize that not everyone in the world is not white.
Many people in this town are ignorant and paranoid and likely believe themselves superior. Others simply haven't thought through the issues or are in the process of coming to terms with the fact that Merchantville is becoming racially integrated. But most people in Merchantville are fair and find it disquieting when people take a simple encounter with Black and Hispanic people as a threat to their sense of wellbeing.
It is also generational. Most younger kids whose parents aren't blatantly racist in all likelihood have a more accepting view toward Black and Hispanic kids. That's progress, although some folks no doubt will decry the "racial mixing."
The beautiful thing is that we get to define ourselves as a community and the vast majority of people here will eventually come around to community being about more than veiled white pride combined with paranoia, and together we will find a way to understand and tolerate people who are different, recognizing that that's a two-way street. The others will hopefully move.
I won't apologize for raising race as an issue bc it's clearly relevant and too easily dismissed with trite responses. The paradigm of "race card" and so-and-so is a racist are barriers to a productive conversation about race and community. That's what is needed, but is hard to do on a blog I suppose.
um EXCUSE ME but to all the idiots saying it's white people scared of grabby blacks, i was the first one who mentioned being "scared not to give candy" and i am an African American woman (not black, thank you).
To you who are making this about race, you are dumbing down the conversation and making us as African American citizens look like we are whiny and grabby. i had grabby kids and grabby adults n i was afraid not to give cany bc they wre up on my porch, in my business, grabbing, outnumbering me, and in most situations, much bigger than me, and i was alone! these were African American, white, Latino, and Asian people behaving this way. You who claim its racist...you're the ignorant one and you should be ashamed of yourselfs!
Sure, let's forget about the people who mentioned their doors being pounded and yanked on, let's forget about the rudeness of adults coming onto your property and shoving as much as they could grab into their bags, let's ignore the litter left behind, the no-costume-free-candy entitled jerks, and let's make this about race. It couldn't have been because of poor behavior. It had to be because there were black people around.
Why do you assume that Susan, Eleanor, Tom, Heather T, Freddie J, Maryann, Katherine, or any of the others with sensible reactions (albeit reactions that differ from yours) were talking about black people? How do you even know that the woman who feared for her bike being stolen was talking about a black person? Did she say that? Show me where.
@give me a break said...
We live next to Camden, a town that is primarily home to people who are Black and Hispanic (and Asian). The people who aren't the neighbors we know and who were from out of town came from there. The references to the bus and numerous other references were people who live near but not in Merchantville. See the reference to Camden too. You don't need a secret decoder ring to understand what people are saying. And in fact a large number of the trick-or-treaters weren't white, a trend that started in the past few years and has continued. You can bury your head in the sand if you want, but eventually you'll need to come up for air.
I identified race as an important issue that people were dancing around. It wasn't what everyone was referring to, but it is what many people were referring to without saying as much.
@nina - Thanks for highlighting that bad behavior crossed all boundaries, which is exactly my point. That is an observation that is helpful to the discussion. I'm curious whether it is shared by others on here. Merchantvillians, do you agree or disagree with Nina?
8 hours is too long for trick or treating. Merchantville is not the mall.
To Tom, I hear you! Especially about the door thing. My doorknob is literally loose now and needs to be repaired after all the people pulling on it while I came to the door (I use a cane and it takes me a minute).
Anonymous 10:31AM, i agree with you for the most part, however it is important to note that, until you brought race into the conversation, no one else was making it about race. No one has said anything that was truly racially insensitive, and claiming "oh, it was inferred. you're ignorant if you don't see that" is one of the oldest, and least effective, tricks in the Internet Troll playbook.
To Nina, I completely agree with you that there was poor, and threatening behavior from the crowds as a whole, not with one particular group within it. There was a lot of grabbing, a huge invasion of personal space and disrespect for property (whatever happened to standing politely and holding your bag open with a smile and a 'trick or treat'?), and in the end, I just felt exploited by a bunch of people who weren't out so their kids could have fun on Halloween, but rather so they could see how many bags of free stuff they could get on one Sunday afternoon. I agree with those who have said that 8 hours is too long, and I agree with Susan that those of us who had bad experiences with too many rude people taking too much and disrespecting us and our property may just was well take our kids to a few specific houses (or the mall!) and let all those who saw Sunday as a beautiful treat do the gifting. Invest in a Sam's Club membership and start buying your candy now!
I would say just give out raisins next year if you don't want a lot of trick or treaters, but who are we kidding, they'll probably take the porch furniture or start pulling up floorboards.
DISCLAIMER: Please note, anyone of any race, culture, or creed is capable of carrying furniture off your porch when raisins are not enough. The above smartass crack was not made racially, and anyone who thinks it was is clearly reading too far into it, has a warped belief that "racial predilections" exist, and is probably just sad because he or she has no more fun size Snickers to eat. I think they're on sale at Rite Aid though!
You are all a bunch of ninnies. It was a good group of kids that came to my door. And more often than not nowadays black kids are much more respectful than white kids. Maybe black families still keep old fashioned discipline and white families want mostly for their kids to know how special they are.
You're still generalizing racially, Reality Check...
And HELLO, who said anything about race before that one poster claimed it was all racist?
Also, namecalling? Please.
Anybody get any trick or treaters for UNICEF?
None for UNICEF, but a whole lot of others, how about you?
Anyone else?
My wife and I noticed the same trend of increased trick or treaters pulling up in vans and rushing to the house to get their candy. Yes, many of them were African American or Hispanic and some were up to 18/19 yrs old, but NONE of them were the least bit rude or grabby. Every single one of them said "trick or treat" with a smile and "thank you" also with a smile after I gave them each a couple pieces of candy.
I'm not trying to discredit those of you who experienced the grabbing and rudeness, because we simply might have had different kids. Just out of curiosity, are those of you who had the rude kids petite or older females vs. young or athletic males? I'm wondering if the kids saw those of you as more vulnerable and therefore took advantage.
From what I experienced, I had no complaints about any of the kids and I was honestly excited to be able to give out candy to kids who seemed to appreciate it - especially if they trick or treated at my house because their own neighborhoods are too dangerous. I take that as a compliment that in my neighborhood children feel safe enough to knock on my door and walk around in the evening.
All I have to say is what is up with the adults trick or treating and what is up with the adults with newborns trick or treating???? Hellooo people, we know your kids aren't eating the candy. We were rushed too and I felt overwhelmed at times. I didn't get to see a lot of kids from town and felt bad when my three year old had to stop trick or treating beacause almost every home was out of candy by 6, but I assumed it was because of the beautiful weather and day of the week.
My house was also overwhelmed by the throngs and after two additional trips to CVS for more candy, I surrendered! I put out the white flag marked "Sorry-out of candy" around 5:15 and dimmed the potch lights. I do hope some under-priviledged kids appreciate my small contributon to their candy
stash but I think the word is out that Merchantville is the candy capital of the world on Halloween.
Poor us!
Here's the question: what do we do next year? IS there anything we can do? We can't put Merchantville's finest at the borders; can't keep all these fine folks out of our town and off our streets. If the word is out that M-ville is Candy Central, what now? Stock up at Costco on industrial sized amounts of goodies and cater to the hordes? Turn out the lights, lock the windows and doors? Give out the "usual" amounts and close up shop afterwards? All of us gather along the Merch Mile and give out goodies there? I'm afraid Halloween (now second only to Xmas as a money spending/money making holiday) is beyond our ability to control...
and oh by the way, the high school send/receive relationship has nothing to do with race either.
what a riot!
Recently talked with an around the corner neighbor whose address is in the western section of Cherry Hill and she had the same halloween we had. Vans pulling up with crowds emptying her candy coffers. She thought it was only Cherry Hill.
That part of Cherry Hill has always been like an extension of Merchantville. They live near us, shop in our stores and take their kids to our parks. How would trick-or treaters know the difference?
But...but..they have different values in Cherry Hill. They told us so.
Nobody from Cherry Hill is on this damm blog and we all know it. That poster is dishonest and should debate the issues honestly instead of disparaging their own town and kids.
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